Thread Rating:
  • 2 Vote(s) - 3 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Stopped with guns in vehicle [was: Another gun thread]
#21
(05-05-2016, 08:25 PM)Bob Dickerson Wrote: I have a few guns for hunting and target shooting.But,I have to say I agree with Ronald Reagan.No civilian has any should be carrying a loaded firearm on the street.

Until they issue cops to every citizen in the convenient pocket-carry rapid-deploying size, I must totally disagree.  We have our God-given right to self defense, and our Constitutionally-guarenteed right to own and bear firearms.  If you choose to not exercise those rights, fine.  But no one has the right to debase us of our rights.
This forum is on probation again.  Bob, turn your PMs on!
Add Thank You Reply
The following 1 user says Thank You to LeeRevell for this post:
Peaceseeker (05-20-2016)
#22
I guess I just don't understand the fear that requires a person to always have a gun at hand.There are many other means of self defense.The best one is to walk away and not escalate a confrontation.Most people killed with guns are killed by someone they know during an argument.What would be a simple fist fight if no gun were present becomes a homicide when one is.For some people,(present company excluded of course.)a gun seems to be a sex object or proof of manhood.I enjoy using my guns for hunting and target shooting,but I don't have a personal relationship with them.They are only tools.
Add Thank You Reply
#23
(05-06-2016, 06:35 AM)Bob Dickerson Wrote: I guess I just don't understand the fear that requires a person to always have a gun at hand.There are many other means of self defense.The best one is to walk away and not escalate a confrontation.Most people killed with guns are killed by someone they know during an argument.What would be a simple fist fight if no gun were present becomes a homicide when one is.For some people,(present company excluded of course.)a gun seems to be a sex object or proof of manhood.I enjoy using my guns for hunting and target shooting,but I don't have a personal relationship with them.They are only tools.

I think it boils down to your personal circumstance and ability.  As a woman I feel pretty vulnerable in some situations, but as a 5'10" former LEO I feel very confident in others.  I do not carry, and really, over time, have developed an aversion to them as my front line defense; I prefer a less lethal option, more for the health of my soul/karma/psyche. But I still own and will use it if need be, and still enjoy the challenge of a quality range day.
“If the words you spoke appeared on your skin, would you still be beautiful?”
~ Auliq Ice
Add Thank You Reply
#24
(05-06-2016, 06:35 AM)Bob Dickerson Wrote: They are only tools.

Absolutely, and exactly our point.  We should not be denied the use of our tools, becasue a few people go to water when they see them.  Guns are not evil, they do not act on their own.  Why should the honest law-abiding gun owner be persecuted for the crimes of a very few?  Why should we be disarmed to smooth the fears of the non-gun people?  Criminals are out there.  You cannot just "walk away".  Call 9-1-1 all you wish.  Maybe the cops can use the signal to locate the owner's corpse.  Many things CAN be used as weapons, but if I have the misfortune to be accosted by a criminal wishing to kill me, I will prefer to have my pistol with me.  Having the chance of personal defense certainly beats pleading with a hardcase to spare one's life.
At the end of the day, it comes down to personal preference - carry a weapon or do not.  The choice should be there for us all.
This forum is on probation again.  Bob, turn your PMs on!
Add Thank You Reply
#25
if you don't like guns, don't have them. it's as simply as that. why do people who don't like guns feel the need to preach to those that do? highdesertranger
Add Thank You Reply
The following 2 users say Thank You to highdesertranger for this post:
Every Road Leads Home (05-08-2016), mockturtle (05-06-2016)
#26
(05-06-2016, 06:35 AM)Bob Dickerson Wrote: I guess I just don't understand the fear that requires a person to always have a gun at hand.There are many other means of self defense.The best one is to walk away and not escalate a confrontation.Most people killed with guns are killed by someone they know during an argument.What would be a simple fist fight if no gun were present becomes a homicide when one is.For some people,(present company excluded of course.)a gun seems to be a sex object or proof of manhood.I enjoy using my guns for hunting and target shooting,but I don't have a personal relationship with them.They are only tools.
  • Actually Bob, most people killed with a gun are suicide (about two thirds of off gun deaths are suicide; 20,000 per year, less than half of all suicides). Yes, they are killed by someone they know... themselves. And guess what, suicide is NOT AGAINST THE LAW. So, the reality is that 2/3 of all gun deaths are legal use of a gun right off the bat.
  • The 2nd largest number of deaths by gun is inner-city-gang-violence (another 9-10,000 per year). I could not speak for if those guys knew each other or not, but that is not a "gun problem" but a "gang problem". Ironically, most of these gang-murders happen in states and cities that are notoriously anti-gun (New York, DC, Chicago, LA, Oakland, etc)
  • That leaves another 2-3000 gun deaths per year. Less than 500 are "accidental", less than 100 are "kids", and less than 400 are due to "domestic violence". Of the remaining, another few hundred are ruled justifiable, and another few hundred are criminals shots by police in the line of duty.
  • Random fist-fight-turns-to-shooting happens, but not enough to even have a statistic for. Maybe a few dozen times a year? Maybe...
Considering the number of guns (300 million +) in this country, and the number of legal gun owners (100 million and rising), these numbers are STAGGERINGLY TINY TO THE LEVEL OF INSIGNIFICANT.

If you do the math, only one in roughly 42,000 guns will ever kill someone, ever... in hundreds of years of existing. That is a whole lot of guns that DO NOT kill... ever, my guns included.

Personally, my gun has never joined me in having sex. I have never thought of it when having sex. I do not masturbate too it. Although you attempt to exclude yourself from this statement, no other gun owner in this thread has made such a statement. I think it is pretty sad, and speaks volumes of the mental-issues going on in the heads of those people who make a statement.
Traveling since 2010 - My BlogMy Van
Add Thank You Reply
The following 6 users say Thank You to Van-Tramp for this post:
LeeRevell (05-06-2016), speedhighway46 (05-06-2016), Bitty (05-06-2016), Oopslala (05-06-2016), TMG51 (05-06-2016), highdesertranger (05-06-2016)
#27
Ahh, gun politics, a never-ending source of dispute.

Many gun toters are afraid that they will be unable to deal with the coarser elements of society without having a gun on their person. Fear seems to be the driving factor, with many even admitting that they feel naked and powerless without a firearm within reach. This bunker mentality is unfit for a van dwelling lifestyle, IMO.

That being said, I do believe in Constitutional carry.
Currently on a six week road trip thru Mexico. Chihuahua - Durango - Tepic - Guadalajara - Morelia - Guanajuato - Zacatecas - ...
Add Thank You Reply
#28
Quote:if you don't like guns, don't have them. it's as simply as that. why do people who don't like guns feel the need to preach to those that do? highdesertranger
Exactly!  Gun-haters should ignore gun posts altogether.
 [Image: Updated%20sig%20pic.jpg]
Add Thank You Reply
The following 1 user says Thank You to mockturtle for this post:
highdesertranger (05-06-2016)
#29
Gun control and its advocates are not about anything other than control. They want to dictate what you should think, believe and how you live. I think the same folks who would deny you a gun would deny you the ability to live in a van on public property. Oh, that's right they already are!
                                                     East of the Sun   West of the Moon
Add Thank You Reply
The following 1 user says Thank You to buckwilk for this post:
Every Road Leads Home (05-08-2016)
#30
(05-06-2016, 04:49 PM)USExplorer Wrote: Many gun toters are afraid that they will be unable to deal with the coarser elements of society without having a gun on their person. Fear seems to be the driving factor, with many even admitting that they feel naked and powerless without a firearm within reach. This bunker mentality is unfit for a van dwelling lifestyle, IMO.

I'll bite.

First of all--you can bet your boots I'm concerned about being "unable to deal with the courser elements of society" without a gun. Few other things would cease the attack of a rapist. I've done a LOT of take-down scenes for fun, and am well aware of the significant limitations on what my personal options would be to fight back. Having a gun is a great equalizer for those at a significant physical disadvantage.

Thus, it makes perfect sense--and is a positive, legitimate thing IMO for a person to feel naked and powerless without it. If I'm unarmed and you want to do something to me, unless by some miracle I manage to use some techniques I've learned, you get to do whatever it is you want. Anything at all. There are sickos in our society that get off on that kind of nonconsentual power trip, and will go to great lengths to prove to their victim just how much power they have. Guns are a sure way of saying "actually, you don't get to do that" in a manner that enforces it.

My mom had a friend once whose vehicle broke down when she was moving cross-country and had everything she owned in her car. Two men stopped to help her, and insisted on doing so. While giving her a ride elsewhere, they openly debated in front of her whether they should rape or, or let her go and just steal all her stuff. She sat there, powerless in the backseat. In the end they decided to steal her stuff instead. She considers herself lucky.

A gun is an equalizer.

"Fear seems to be the driving factor"? No more than a fear of accidents is the driving factor to wearing a seatbelt. There is legitimate concern--and accident is a violent, unexpected thing that is far worse if you don't happen to be wearing one at the time--thus, you implement the habit of putting on your seatbelt every time you get in a vehicle. Once the habit is implemented, there is no more need for the emotion of fear to play any role in the equation. It's there in case you need it, and that's all.

In fact, many who carry on their person feel this actually results in experiencing far less fear in potentially dangerous situations, because they know if things start going south they have a powerful self-defense option at their fingertips.

You see it as a bunker mentality; I see it as a realistic one.

One night a friend carried me a couple blocks to my van, where I had parked in the only spot I could find with my nose to a fence, just off the road. It was dark out. A vehicle blasting rap music with windows down passed slowly just as we arrived at my van and my friend set me down and I got in. My friend, oblivious to the situation, jogged off into the night. The car turned around and passed by slowly a couple more times, before simply stopping in the middle of the road, blocking me from leaving. My van was completely boxed in front and back. You can bet I was terrified as I sat there with the keys in the ignition, holding my breath. After a tense minute or so he then pulled over to park right beside me. Driver's door open, music still blasting and engine still on, he was on the phone with someone as he stared at me. I turned the key and gunned it outta there so fast, and have never returned to that area since.

If he hadn't moved his car I wouldn't have been able to pull my van out. Running on foot wasn't an option. It was an old van with no alarm system. The perpetrator's behavior showed I was being targeted; the loud blasting of rap music with windows down (at ~11pm) indicates at best someone on a power trip, at worst someone involved in a gang. The phone call suggests the latter is more likely.

I could share so many more stories, but if you don't have similar stories of your own or if loved ones haven't told you of similar situations I doubt it'd change anyone's mind. Maybe this doesn't happen in your area, or doesn't happen to you, and if so that's awesome! It does to me, and thus colors my view on the subject considerably differently than yours.
Add Thank You Reply
The following 4 users say Thank You to Bitty for this post:
minimotos95 (05-07-2016), Van-Tramp (05-06-2016), LeeRevell (05-06-2016), mockturtle (05-06-2016)


Forum Jump:


Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)

Powered By MyBB, © 2002-2018 MyBB Group.