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http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/doj-cit...spartandhp

here is the article

"...Boise, like many cities — the number of which has swelled since the recession — has an ordinance banning sleeping or camping in public places. But such laws, the DOJ says, effectively criminalize homelessness itself in situations where people simply have nowhere else to sleep. From the DOJ's filing:
"When adequate shelter space exists, individuals have a choice about whether or not to sleep in public. However, when adequate shelter space does not exist, there is no meaningful distinction between the status of being homeless and the conduct of sleeping in public. Sleeping is a life-sustaining activity — i.e., it must occur at some time in some place. If a person literally has nowhere else to go, then enforcement of the anti-camping ordinance against that person criminalizes her for being homeless...."
Interesting.

BUT . . .

I'm not sure how much it will really apply to us.

I seem to recall reading an article about - I wanna say AZ or NM.  The court there REQUIRED the cops to offer transportation to a shelter before they could make an arrest.  But if the person REFUSED to go along to the shelter, THEN they could arrest him.

So we're sleeping in our van somewhere where there is an ordinance against it.  Cops come along at o-dark-30 and wake us up and say:  "You can't sleep in a van.  Come along with us and we'll take you to a shelter."  Now the choice is go to the shelter or go to jail.

We'll have to see how this all plays out.

Regards
John
I have known people who live homeless due to either choice or mental health. The shelters aren't open year round.
I just read an article on MSN.com about it. It says people sleeping in the open. I don't know that is the same as living in a $10,000 van. The prosecutor could argue that you have the resources to rent a room, and it is by your choice not necessity, that you are sleeping in a vehicle.
I think it really comes down to the right to the pursuit of happiness, but this ruling doesn't address that.
Remember that unless the underlying activity is a fundamental right in the Constitution, the court's test will be the "Rational Basis Test". Was there a rational basis for enacting the law? If so, it's constitutional.

The Rational Basis Test is the lowest level of scrutiny offered for any constitutional challenge.
How great are our Founding Fathers!  They actually had the foresight to include in the Constitution and Bill of Rights provision for homeless and vandwellers!  Those guys were geniuses!   Wink
so does this mean that we just all claim we are homeless (for that week) and get out of jail card is invoked? Can I claim I am homeless on BLM land, and they leave me alone? So many law ways to trip up a person; and waste federal money prosecuting them (but paying lawyers a nice government salary and time to spent chasing someone).
(08-13-2015, 04:34 PM)Optimistic Paranoid Wrote: [ -> ]Interesting.

BUT . . .

I'm not sure how much it will really apply to us.

I seem to recall reading an article about - I wanna say AZ or NM.  The court there REQUIRED the cops to offer transportation to a shelter before they could make an arrest.  But if the person REFUSED to go along to the shelter, THEN they could arrest him.

So we're sleeping in our van somewhere where there is an ordinance against it.  Cops come along at o-dark-30 and wake us up and say:  "You can't sleep in a van.  Come along with us and we'll take you to a shelter."  Now the choice is go to the shelter or go to jail.

We'll have to see how this all plays out.

Regards
John

You don't think he'd simply let you drive elsewhere yourself?
(08-14-2015, 07:28 AM)TMG51 Wrote: [ -> ]You don't think he'd simply let you drive elsewhere yourself?

I think probably most places, yes.

But there are some places that are practically bankrupt.  And it's an observed fact that some places run speed traps specifically because they want the revenue that brings in from outsiders.  So I could conceive of some places where the cops would be under orders to roust you, tell you you have to go to a shelter, and then arrest you when you refuse just so you could be fined.  They need the money.  And you're an outsider who doesn't live there, vote there, or pay taxes there.

But it's a well known fact here that I'm paranoid, so feel free to disparage that theory.  I don't mind.

Regards
John
And if they direct you to a shelter, can you park in shelter parking lot? And have that be equivalent?
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